Daimonin MMORPG

Dev Team => Gameservers => Global moderators => Test server => Topic started by: jmaxou on 04, May 2007, 11:14:29

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: jmaxou on 04, May 2007, 11:14:29

Hi guys.
I am trying to test th B4 version and discovered that, under windows, the
m letter does not come out ! any idea about that ? (it is all under B3).
Thanks.

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: grommit on 04, May 2007, 12:43:42

If it's any help to someone investigating this problem, the mM on the french keyboard is the key that is mapped to ;: on the UK and US keyboards. (I don't have time at the moment).

PS: this should be moved to the bugs thread.

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: Husavik on 04, May 2007, 13:49:58

I also  have a french keyboard and  already  have  this  problem  on B3  ( and some other online games )

For "A"pplying  I  use  "Q"
For "Q"uest list ( in b4 )  I use "A"
For "M"ark I use "?"

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: grommit on 04, May 2007, 14:18:18

In which case is is exactly as I suspected - Daimonin assumes US keyboard layout and uses the key positions rather than the actual character values.

I will enter this as a client bug in Mantis.

Edit: Mantis #639

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: michtoen on 04, May 2007, 14:41:49

Sorry, thats not a real bug - thats how SDL and keyboards are working.

Real games engines have a complete engine part releated to dealing with
keyboards, SDL don't have it.

This is not a trivial bug - you must have in mind that there are for example
keyboards out which are for a language which has no X. Like asian
languages. So - which key is now assigned as substitution for it?

Let me point it out - there is no rule, no technical interface which
key has which keyboard signal - means the raw byte code.

That can be different from keyboard to keyboard - even for the
same language (its possible, but i can't remember i ever saw
it, honestly).

Remember that there are special "gamer" keyboards which special
keys for the most common games.

The communication which signal is what is done by the drivers.

And THERE the problems start, because that driver hook in
pretty high in the OS protocol layer. Higher for example as
DirectX get its data (most).

Windows sorts it out by attaching a driver to their text input.
That makes sense - because windows for asia for example
still works internal "in english". That means that system strings,
which for example are used for pipes are not in chinese now.
If they would, only binary program protocols would work between
different languages. The "what keyboard has the user attached
to my english program" is pretty high level part - for your OS.

That driver are OVER the layer DirectX or other low level
systems are. That means also DirectInput will give you the raw
signal.

Somewhere between that a game coder must hook in.

Because for the PC - means your hardware - the keyboard is
somewhat low level.

Its more or less a design problem of the PC architecture -
as the PC was invented no one thought about to have a
smart keyboard interface. What every PC has today is
still from the computer stone age.

The whole things is hard to explain, just try to check it out.
You can change in windows and linux the "keyboard & language"
setting for single programs (in windows in the tray part left to
the try bar icons). Play around with it and try to make SDL
smart enough to notice the different layout. Its not trivial
and you have to do it on your own (and remember that some
keyboards perhaps don't even HAVE your key).

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: smacky on 04, May 2007, 15:11:37

Woot! I was more or less on the right track in my note in Mantis.

Perhaps overly optimistic in assigning it to myself. ;) I don't think I can really fix PC design. LOL

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: grommit on 04, May 2007, 16:31:14

OK. Points taken. As per my note in Mantis:

There is a simple solution which avoids a new user having to delve into the realms of key customisations, or use non-intuitive key labels.

Supply variants of the key.dat file for the 4 main Western keyboard layouts (QWERTY, QWERTZ, AZERTY and QZERTY) in the installation kit, to be chosen by the user as required.

There are, I think, only 11 keys that need to be re-assigned, and it's only AZERTY that has a real problem.

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: longir on 04, May 2007, 17:21:34

hmmmm few keys/key combinations are hard-coded (ctrl + for firing ranged, and shift for inventory), everything else that is pre-defined uses macros.  So the only real problems is if ctrl or shift on both sides are broken, in which case a new keyboard is in order.

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: spyke on 04, May 2007, 19:41:33

O.o i never knowed i have french keyboard! but i tought it was a noob keyboard with mixed up buttons :P well now i know i have a french version :)
Tnx guys :P

Title: french keyboard problem.
Post by: grommit on 04, May 2007, 21:02:15

Quote from: "spyke"

i tought it was a noob keyboard with mixed up buttons

Maybe you're not wrong :D